The Scottish Government has helpfully listened to the problems we highlighted for islanders from Islay and Tiree in getting to the Information Session to be held in Oban on Thursday 11th October.
Marine Scotland has just let us know that it has now added an additional session to facilitate people from these islands, both central to the marine energy development in Argyll – one out in the Atlantic, the other served by a ferry port well south of Oban.
The second session – also in Oban’s Corran Halls, is on Friday 12th October, from 13.30 to 15.30 and will also be open to everyone interested.
The addition of the Friday session will make it possible for interested people frpm Islay to get to Oban for the session and get bac,k to Kennacraig for the last ferry home that night.
People from Tiree always have to stay overnight but will be able comfortably to get to Oban for the start of the session.
The events focus on the government’s ongoing marine planning work for these renewable energies – an issue of substantial current interest with planning authorities instructed to ease their scrutiny regime for onshore wind farms.development.
Further information on this work can be found here on the government website.
Programme for Thursday 11th October
- 16.00: Drop-in session
- 18.30: Presentation and discussion, with refreshments from 18.30
Programme for Friday 12th October *ADDITIONAL SESSION
- 13.30 – 15,30 Presentation and discussion, we imagine alos wiht refreshments available.
Second to the Pentland Firth, the Sound of Islay is the most important potential development area for tidal energy generation and a trial array there is in progress. The Islay Energy Trust has been proactive and resourceful in its contribution to this development.
And Tiree is at the centre of the most contentious proposed offshore wind development of all – Scottish Power Renewables’ gigantic Argyll Array, renamed the [No] Tiree Array:
- 180-300 turbines
- over 200m high
- starting only 5km offshore
- wrapping around the island from SE to NW
- occupying a sea area 3.5 times the size of the flat little sunshine isle
- whose weather systems will be altered for the worse by the microclimate these giants will create
- and which will experience night light pollution for the first time.
“•whose weather systems will be altered for the worse by the microclimate these giants will create”
This is a a hypothesis on both counts, first that the weather will be altered, and secondly that it will necessarily be for the worse. There may well be impacts, but that remains to be proven. Stating it as if it were fact is both dishonest and irresponsible.
I expect flagrant anti-wind bias when I read forargyll, but this is egregious even by your standards.
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No it is not a hypothesis. Impacts are proven…what do you class as a benificial climate impact and a detremental climate impact ? If the Tiree Array goes ahead in it’s current guise there will be onshore changes to Tiree’s current climate.
You cannot place a turbine anywhere without it taking energy from the atmosphere…Place several hundred turbines in an area and the effects are obviously multiplied….We on Tiree are happy the way our weather is now….change caused by such a huge array will happen over a short time scale…
It seems strange that you will not accept what the developer SPR has already accepted, climate change will occur on Tiree caused directly by the industrialisation of our inshore waters.
Rgds
Karl
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I don’t imagine most people on Tiree would be enormously concerned if, say, average wind speeds on the island dropped by a couple of mph. I’d be rather surprised, given how exposed Tiree is, if there was any impact that was noticable to the casual observer.
I suppose for clarity I should have said “substantial change”, because anything we do has weather effects – not least the continued use of fossil fuels, so you are correct that there will almost inevitably be some change. It could quite easily be neutral (a couple of extra days of rain a year, slightly reduced wind speed), but what it is mostly is uncertain. Certainly the case for it being substantial and detrimental has not been made.
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I would leave it up to the experts. SPR will now be studying the effects.
As for your imagination: ” I don’t imagine most people on Tiree would be enormously concerned”
I assure you Tiree folk are very concerned, you are talking about our home isle.
Rgds karl
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I live here too. I really can’t think what difference a slight change in wind speed would make. Certainly the effects should be investigated, but that’s rather my point – it’s by no means certain whether there will be any significant effect, and what it will be if there is. Making out that there is a known, substantial and negative impact is, as I originally said, downright dishonest. Wait until we actually have the evidence before passing judgement.
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One thing is for sure… wind-speed will not increase due to the deployment, so I doubt if there is any threat that YOU (especially) will get blown over
puts a whole new angle to the expression “blow in” does it not ?
Given the small population on Tiree and the nature of small remote communities I understand the limited anonymity…but really SPR could do with a bit more support on the island, so why not come out of the cupboard with your convictions ? speak up for the proposed Tiree Array ? rather than sit on the ethereal seat of neutrality .
Rgds
Karl
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Organising a second meeting is one thing – listening to views and making changes to policy is another.
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Hi,
Maybe the Scottish government would be willing to pay the Tirisdeach ferry fares and overnight accom in Oban ?
Nope ? thought not…..
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Do I take it from this comment that you and fellow NTA members will not be attending because of the cost? I kind of presumed that NTA would have some money in a ‘fighting fund’.
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I would love to go but the flight from Iraq is expensive. as for NTA members attending…some will…as for Tirisdeach (?) your guess is as good as mine.
For certain SPR have another vacuous session scheduled on Tiree in the not to distant future.
Ta
Karl
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At least, if they arise, you can be ass-ured Donald won’t buy out your wee isle for his next crazy golf rip off. How do you square that one Alex! No reply necessary.
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Plan on energy reduction and you want have to worry about the Tiree Array. When are you guys going to wizen up ??
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We’re all going to wizen up in the end Henri . . . .
Pretty quiet in the Corran Halls this afternoon.
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The Hall was quiet – I wasn’t
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I do hope you weren’t rude to the nice lady from Marine Scotland Malcolm.
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Aye…it’s one fact both side of the argument are aware of around 30% of what is generated..is wasted. Why would the government and EU wizen up ? saving does not pay shareholders…
Tiree aka Argyll array has nothing to do with meeting commitments and all to do with generating cash…in this case for the failing spanish economy.
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What – as rude as Mike Mackenzie MSP is to ferrymen?
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For anyone not familiar with how an offshore wind farm looks, this is a proposal for down the Ayrshire coast. Marine Scotland have actually scoped an area to within 1km of Turnberry Golf Course where there could be wind turbines at some point in the future. However they work on the principal of marking out a large area and then leaving it up to others eg Planners, Locals etc to knock it back. I made the visualisation for Struan Stevenson MEP and CATS who have since issued it as a press release and I believe it is also to be used in a book to be published sometime soon. The turbines are 130m high and the nearest is 2.55km from the camera.
http://www.windfarms.me.uk/wind9.html
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With energy prices going up by some 8% does that make wind power become 8% cheaper over night, nuclear power still has fall out though.
http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8464/8080240220_dd5c15b978_b.jpg
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Nope…would you take an 8% cut in your share price !
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Excellent piece: “Alex on his knees praying in Bute house” lord make me green…err, but not just yet”
Malcolm you will enjoy this. SR…this will hurt !!!!
http://www.scotsman.com/news/alf-young-renewables-path-won-t-run-smoothly-1-2571002
and the numpty had this to say last week…
http://www.scotsman.com/news/environment/green-policy-and-oil-not-at-odds-says-salmond-1-2567670
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I’m well aware of the alleged dilemma of funding a green revolution with ‘dirty’ money . . . though as an oil industry worker yourself you could be laying yourself open to charges of hypocrisy from people less broad minded on the issue than myself
However, my view is that for the next twenty or thirty years a lot of oil is going to be burnt whatever we do here – the ‘green revolution’ won’t happen overnight. And if oil is going to be burnt it might as well be our oil, no?
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SR…I am a HSE professional…not an oil worker. My skills are transferable…I am as happy to work for renewables as I am mining, O&G or indeed as a consultant to Marine Harvest…so don’t even bother going down that avenue…people matter to me more than the final product.
Your answer/view SR is thankfully more genuine and honest than the current governments…they really need to address the hypocrisy openly and not dodge the issue…but that would be far too much to ask for from tartan tories.
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Karl: I for one take great offence to your comment about “Tartan Tories”. It is a cheap jibe, unworthy of political debate. Just because the Labour Party in Scotland want to re-introduce tuition fees, re-introduce taxing the sick and are cosying up to the Conservatives in the “No” campaign, does not give you the right to brand them as “Tartan Tories”.
Back to energy: while global consumption of oil, gas and coal will continue to rise, the UK’s consumption has fallen and will continue to fall. Why bother pursuing renewables in the UK if this has no effect on global fossil fuel consumption? There are two compelling reasons:
1: When a car suddenly pulls out in front of you, giving you no time to avoid a collision, you still stomp on the brakes. The brakes won’t stop the collision but the reduction in speed will lessen the damage and injury caused by the crash. So it is with renewables: they slow the process of CO2 related damage down, giving us more time to come up with better plans to ameliorate and reverse the damage that greenhouse gases are doing.
2: Despite the revolution in shale gas and oil extraction in the US and elsewhere, there is no getting round the issue that cheap oil is now a thing of the past. The oil and gas deposits in the US are not some new find; instead, they have been known about for decades but what has changed is the development of fracking techniques and, more importantly, the rising price of oil which makes it economic to exploit these difficult to get reserves. By reducing our dependence on oil in the UK then we make ourselves more economically competitive and energy secure.
The gloomy prognosis is that we are now unable to make much of a dent in CO2 emissions such that we can limit temperature rises to 2oC. This will become worse if and when the world economy emerges from recession. Renewables will not displace fossil fuels (except locally) but will help prevent fuel shortages caused by Peak Oil constraints.
Renewables are, therefore (at least in the short term), much more important in terms of fuel security than they are for abating climate change. Ironically, they may actually be a negative influence in the short term as they offset the reality of Peak Oil, making it easier for the World to increase its overall energy production rather than instigate dramatic (and draconian) conservation measures which would directly impact on CO2 emissions.
So, am I arguing that we should not pursue renewables? Of course not. They make huge sense from a national perspective in improving fuel security and ensuring we have a good generating mix. They also help fill the energy “gap” that is forecast to occur in the UK by 2015 (though expect various fudges to prevent the gap occurring). Globally, renewables help keep the lights on and transport running despite Peak Oil and, as the cost of renewable technologies comes down, they will begin to displace fossil fuel use. Indeed in some parts of the planet, solar generation of electricity is already at convergence with fossil fuels. Eventually they will replace fossil fuel use . The question is not if but when and will that be quick enough (probably not).
Algal biofuels give us the potential to start replacing fossil oil in transportation as they can be scaled up to meet global demands and without changing our engine technologies. There is the danger that, again, all that will happen is that the availability of affordable algal oil makes it easier for us to avoid the consequences of Peak Oil. The answer to that is to continually ramp up carbon taxes so that fossil fuels are eventually priced out of the market. This will, however, take decades and there is considerable pressure from the big polluters outside of Europe to resist carbon taxes (much like smokers who resist smoking bans in public places – depressingly putting their self-interest above global interests).
It is interesting to note that the energy companies taking flak for price increases are blaming not just wholesale rises in fuel prices (mostly gas) but also the impact of carbon taxes. However, we need these rises in fuel costs to drive our society into taking measures to conserve energy. It is a carrot and stick approach and it is beginning to work as households and industry put more effort into energy conservation (in Europe at least).
We live in interesting times as far as energy is concerned (and we all know what Confucius said about them). There are no quick and easy solutions to the problems that beset us. However, what we cannot do is simply ignore the problems, stick our fingers in our ears and loudly sing “La-la-la” in the hope that they will go away. We owe our children much better than that.
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And, of course, in today’s Glasgow Herald, Nicola Sturgeon was blaming Westminster for the recent hike in electricity and gas prices!
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Broadly speaking she’s right;
1) if permission for shale gas drilling had been more expeditiously dealt with the wholesale gas price would be lower
2) if there was an actual energy policy instead of a policy vacuum then wholesale electricity prices might be more stable and lower
The SNP’s unaffordable and unfeasible ‘renewables’ policy isn’t helping the issue though.
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The current governments (Scottish) renewables policy is not based on saving the environment, it’s a cobbled together, poorly planned mess…a vision without sense. If they (governments) can’t get the renewables issue closed out in good fashion for the people of Scotland…how on earth can they be trusted with anything else.
Politicians…whatever the creed, nowadays seem more intent on grabbing votes and kudos than they do relating to the people who have put them in power with honesty and integrity…it’s an endemic plague that runs through all self serving interests…banking, big business inc, etc…greedy anarchy.
When did anybody last trust a word to come out of public services. I feel this parasitic bias is partly driven by the real-time media we all now have access to..sat TV, internet, mobile phone, tweeting etc.etc a big brother come facebook planet…we need some drastic changes not only in energy policy but in the way we are governed.
It is obvious we do need an energy mix or we will soon be in the dark…but again I feel we need to stop wastage first and then re-nationalise the energy providers…and where possible go local.
Interesting times to be one of the plebs
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‘…a big brother come facebook planet…’ – a not altogether attractive vision.
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There is no point depending on renewables to provide us with a reliable supply of electricity. If the Scottish Government carries on with this daft policy in several years time, people in Scotland will suffer from power cuts due to reliable power stations being closed down at the end of their working life.
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