Comment posted Please respond to the A83 Petition today by ferryman.
I just like competition, then I don’t need to worry.
You are correct that the prices on the old streaker service were comparable with WF. But the streakers went further, with more crew, using old inefficient vessels, silly shore ticketing arrangements and a ridiculous timetable – yet the vehicle portion still turned a profit i.e. WF must have been turning a good profit.
ferryman also commented
- RW: no you don’t understand basic economics. The WF route carries far higher traffic volumes and has economies of scale not available on the Tarbert route.
- If I want to get to Campbeltown I get the ferry from Portavadie to Tarbert. Its not my fault if Newsroom has blinkered vision and cannot see beyond roads.
- Newsroom (aka soapbox) wrote : ” the lack of safe crossing points at Ardrishaig and Tarbert”.
Are you suggesting there is an unsafe ferry crossing operating at Tarbert?
Recent comments by ferryman
- Reminder: Argyll Ferries on ‘refit’ service schedule
The scottish Government has failed to deliver on the transferable ferry tickets it was going to setup. The bus scheme is a bodge that adds anything upto two hours to travel time.Any news on what they are going to do for Cowal Games or are they just going to try another gamble on the weather.
- New Campbeltown ferry pilot – a whale beached before it starts
They did not refuse to give car/ferry passenger service to Dunoon – they took it away!They went back on a maniefesto committment to provide new vehicle ferries and then to cap it all they made an incompetent botch by putting in a totally and uttery unreliable passenger only service.
- Inexplicable blame game from MSP on lack of cross-ticketing on Dunoon ferries
“no carrier could justify running a heavier and thirstier craft than necessary”The “than necessary” is the critical point. If you are specifying a commuter service to get people to and from work, hospital college etc. then it is necessary and perfectly possible to specify vessels able to operate reliably on the Clyde.
What you do not do is accept vessels which regularly and repeatedly fail to run for days at a time.
Newsroom wrote “physical facts are the physical facts”, they are indeed and the current bathtubs are far too small for reliable operation. In any case the Ali Cat was operating unreliably on the route already so her current performance is no surprise.
- Inexplicable blame game from MSP on lack of cross-ticketing on Dunoon ferries
I take exception to your statement that “The Argyll Ferries’ passenger boats, being necessarily lighter craft, are more prone to delay and cancellation in a bit of a blow”.Transport Scotland should have specified vessels able to provide a reliable service. They did not hence the problem.
Also the gentleman referred to in the article in the Observer concluded by saying he did not want a lot of energy devoted to cross ticketing etc he wanted it devoted to the getting his town centre ferry service taking him to the trains to work.
That of course makes sense because even if he could transfer totally reliably to and from Western at no cost at all he would still be late for work.
- Western Ferries: new sailings, inflation rises in fares – and protection for concessions
“the consensus seemed to be that they would be too expensive to be used as passenger only ferries”Exactly. Here you have ferries known to be reliable in the sea conditions on the route, able to operate at a fantastic profit when carrying vehicles but not economic carrying only passengers.
AF are suspended again today, they were off all day yesterday, because they use bathtubs not remotely suited for the purpose to which they are being put.
The sensible thing is to use larger ferries on the town centre route and let them carry vehicles. As CalMac demonstrated, before the Government of the day stopped them, putting on more sailings increased revenue and cut subsidy.
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Newsroom (aka soapbox) wrote : ” the lack of safe crossing points at Ardrishaig and Tarbert”.
Are you suggesting there is an unsafe ferry crossing operating at Tarbert?
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Ferryman you must be the only person in the world that – when reading about road crossing points – thinks of a ferry.
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If I want to get to Campbeltown I get the ferry from Portavadie to Tarbert. Its not my fault if Newsroom has blinkered vision and cannot see beyond roads.
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I’m surprised that you don’t drive around, on principle, if you think that WF is a ripoff, as Calmac’s charges seem remarkably similar, or is it that you don’t think of Calmac as profiting from your money?
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I just like competition, then I don’t need to worry.
You are correct that the prices on the old streaker service were comparable with WF. But the streakers went further, with more crew, using old inefficient vessels, silly shore ticketing arrangements and a ridiculous timetable – yet the vehicle portion still turned a profit i.e. WF must have been turning a good profit.
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You misunderstand – the prices you pay on the Tarbert – Portavadie route are comparable to those on WF’s route, for a similar distance.
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RW: no you don’t understand basic economics. The WF route carries far higher traffic volumes and has economies of scale not available on the Tarbert route.
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A fair point, Ferryman, but I still think that your habit of endlessly referring to WF’s profits rather than their charges or fares suggests an excessive degree of resentment just because they’re a private company, rather than because of their charges.
The comments made by others about widespread reluctance among ferry operators to publish commercial vehicle rates surprises me, as I would have thought that in this day & age of European regulation there’d be laws insisting on more transparency – unless there was competition that might argue for commercial confidentiality.
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The only way to decide what the fare should be is to look at the level of profit. If the profit level is fair then you cannot really grumble about the fare, however high it is.
That is why you cannot directly compare WF with the Portavadie Tarbert route.
Also whilst dropping fares on WF route would stimulate increased traffic that is less true on Portavadie Tarbert.
High volume low cost ferries is what Dunoon and Cowal need but there is no hope of reduced fares when WF cannot cope with the current demand.
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Your right, given the longer crossing and the additional costs, the fares should have been higher.
Whoops does that mean that the vehcile fares were being kept down by subsidy payments.
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Donald McDonald:
No the certified accounts of the Cowal Ferries (and the earlier review by the EU) showed the vehicle portion made a profit.
So the question is were WF making an excessive profit?
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