Comment posted A83 back on hazard alert with severe weather warning by ferryman.
Here is a video of a landslide taking place
Here are the after effects
The hills in the above seem to be quite gentle and wooded.
I have no idea the extent of the problem at the “Rest” but if it is remotely like the above the road could be shut for years.
ferryman also commented
- Robert, for once I am going to agree with you.
The slips appear to travel a vertical distance of 100m and a horizontal distance of 150m to hit the A83.
After the A83 the gradient then actually increases before slacking off.
To get from the A83 to the old road seems to be a vertical distance of 75m and a horizontal distance of 100m.
It does look like the old road could also get hit at the same time as the A83.
- The British Geological Survey have a good page on the problem here;
http://www.bgs.ac.uk/landslides/RABT_2009.html
There is an informative poster on the 2007 slide here
http://www.bgs.ac.uk/downloads/start.cfm?id=1245
The bedrock does not seem to be playing much of a part in the problem, though the poster mentions a fault in the bedrock, the bedrock being highly fractured in places, and the scouring flow of the slip opening up jointing in the bedrock.
- Our MSP said “The longer term route survey also needs to report quickly”.
You wrote “the problem at the Rest is due to rainfall saturation of just the surface material overlaying the bedrock causing it to ‘lose its grip’ on the side of a glacially over-steepened valley”.
Do you have a link to a report saying the Rest situation is “just surface material” and quantify the tonnage of the material that might slip and the stability of the bedrock? The Rest is very steep the “surface material” could be considerable.
- Like I said expect extreme weather for at least the next five years because every time the bathtub boats cannot sail or the roads are likely to close the weather will be extreme.
Has our MSP got any further with his vision of tunnels under the Firth of Clyde and the Irish Sea. Is he going to throw one in under the Arrochar Alps?
Has he actually done anything to get a final solution for the A83?
Mike Russell mentioned a tunnel in Japan. The earthquake and tsunami in Japan caused horrendous damage to infrastructure and a major nuclear alert. Within weeks repairs had been effected on motorways etc. Here we are 5 years down the line and Mike Russell has not managed to get a temporary solution in place for the A83 and he has not even managed to get plans drawn up for a permanent solution. He has managed to get a “not fit for purpose” ferry service in Dunoon.
Recent comments by ferryman
- Argyll Flyer in Ardmaleish boatyard
Will the current linkspan works be completed by Friday 21/June?Working on the linkspan while the Argyll Flyer was having its recent scheduled maintenance would have made sense, but they did not do it.
Bring forward maintenance on the Argyll Flyer by a minimum of 6 months and more than likely 8-9 months seems odd.
Why are they not waiting till September to work on the Argyll Flyer. That is closer to when she is due her maintenance and I hear the Gourock linkspan will be out of action again then?
- Shetland Line remains in legal contention with Scottish Government on Northlink Ferries tender
Regarding the Dunoon Gourock ferry service one of the ‘needs and requirements’ the Scottish Government failed to specify was that the vessels employed could actually operate reliably in the weather on the Firth of Clyde.How incompetent is that!
- Argyll Flyer spotted going into Ardmaleish yard on Bute this afternoon
The Ali Cat was having technical problems whilst the Argyll Flyer was being maintained recently, resulting in periods of no service.
Following its maintenance the Argyll Flyer was indeed continuing to suffer technical problems.
The linkspan at Gourock is now being serviced with the result that the Argyll ferries is, once again running a reduced service. This happened right through the Dunoon Film Festival.
It is beyond belief that the Argyll Flyer maintenance and the repairs to the linkspan should not have been planned to run concurrently and without clashing with the Film Festival. - Scottish Government forced to intervene on loose-mouthed Russell gaffe in Campbeltown
JimB asked “why does Dunoon not set out to attract day trippers?”Dunoon would make an excellent destination for people from Glasgow seeking both Day Tripper and Weekend Breaks.
Why don’t they come though?
Well they certainly won’t drive the long way round, it is too far. There are plenty of other attractive destinations that are closer to home.
A relatively short drive and the pleasant experience of a ferry crossing to the town ought to be attractive, but then we hit the price barrier – £44.50 for a young family of 4 in a car.
Why would people pay that premium to come to Dunoon when they can go elsewhere?
The passenger only service is unattractive because of its unreliability.
What Dunoon needs is a truly competing vehicle ferry services.
- Reminder: Argyll Ferries on ‘refit’ service schedule
The scottish Government has failed to deliver on the transferable ferry tickets it was going to setup. The bus scheme is a bodge that adds anything upto two hours to travel time.Any news on what they are going to do for Cowal Games or are they just going to try another gamble on the weather.
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Like I said expect extreme weather for at least the next five years because every time the bathtub boats cannot sail or the roads are likely to close the weather will be extreme.
Has our MSP got any further with his vision of tunnels under the Firth of Clyde and the Irish Sea. Is he going to throw one in under the Arrochar Alps?
Has he actually done anything to get a final solution for the A83?
Mike Russell mentioned a tunnel in Japan. The earthquake and tsunami in Japan caused horrendous damage to infrastructure and a major nuclear alert. Within weeks repairs had been effected on motorways etc. Here we are 5 years down the line and Mike Russell has not managed to get a temporary solution in place for the A83 and he has not even managed to get plans drawn up for a permanent solution. He has managed to get a “not fit for purpose” ferry service in Dunoon.
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Here is a video of a landslide taking place
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E5FF3vIEIqg
Here are the after effects
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vJtYTbQecNE
The hills in the above seem to be quite gentle and wooded.
I have no idea the extent of the problem at the “Rest” but if it is remotely like the above the road could be shut for years.
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Not remotely like the above – whereas the problem at the Rest is due to rainfall saturation of just the surface material overlaying the bedrock causing it to ‘lose its grip’ on the side of a glacially over-steepened valley, at Maierato in Calabria it was apparently the effect of water saturation, and decomposition, of a very deep zone of soft rocks and clays leading to a big chunk of hillside sliding and crumbling away.
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Our MSP said “The longer term route survey also needs to report quickly”.
You wrote “the problem at the Rest is due to rainfall saturation of just the surface material overlaying the bedrock causing it to ‘lose its grip’ on the side of a glacially over-steepened valley”.
Do you have a link to a report saying the Rest situation is “just surface material” and quantify the tonnage of the material that might slip and the stability of the bedrock? The Rest is very steep the “surface material” could be considerable.
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No, I don’t have a link – I have a letter from the British Geological Survey, in Edinburgh, about ten years ago in reply to a question to them on whether the A83 would be more secure if relocated to the route of the forestry road on the opposite side of the glen upstream of the ‘Wee Rest’.
They explained that Glen Croe was an example of a valley that had been gouged deeper by glacial action, leaving the sides steeper than their natural angle of repose. The sides would continue to erode until they reached a stable slope angle. As far as I’m aware the surface ‘drift’ material is generally a relatively shallow layer over the bedrock.
There’s also Scotland Transerv’s ‘Geotechnical desk study’ of July 2008, available via Google.
I’ll email a scan of the BGS letter to F.A., so hopefully it’ll be available to read.
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The British Geological Survey have a good page on the problem here;
http://www.bgs.ac.uk/landslides/RABT_2009.html
There is an informative poster on the 2007 slide here
http://www.bgs.ac.uk/downloads/start.cfm?id=1245
The bedrock does not seem to be playing much of a part in the problem, though the poster mentions a fault in the bedrock, the bedrock being highly fractured in places, and the scouring flow of the slip opening up jointing in the bedrock.
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The photo in the 2007 report clearly shows how landslips can also threaten the old road below the A83, so there’s the question of whether this route might not be a viable emergency alternative.
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Robert, for once I am going to agree with you.
The slips appear to travel a vertical distance of 100m and a horizontal distance of 150m to hit the A83.
After the A83 the gradient then actually increases before slacking off.
To get from the A83 to the old road seems to be a vertical distance of 75m and a horizontal distance of 100m.
It does look like the old road could also get hit at the same time as the A83.
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Somewhere in the recent government-commissioned reports there’s reference to historic records of the old road being affected by landslides and/or rockfalls, so it’s all the more surprising that Transport Scotland should now be considering this route as the emergency alternative.
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